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    Topic:   Chronological order  

    This topic contains 3 replies, has 2 voices, and was last updated by kiwi kiwi 1 year, 6 months ago.

    Viewing 4 posts - 1 through 4 (of 4 total)
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    • #5571
      macalter
      macalter
      Participant

      534 posts

      If an event starts January 1, 2015 and another is FROM January 1, 2015, then why would the first appear and the latter may appear after any other event listed, be it the same year or even years later:

      I expected:
      1 – January 1, 2015
      2 – from January 1, 2015 to January 1, 2016
      3 – January 2, 2017

      Display is random, maybe after many years later:
      1 – January 1, 2015
      2 – January 2, 2017
      3 – from January 1, 2015 to January 1, 2016

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      #5572
      kiwi
      kiwi
      Keymaster

      1431 posts

      That’s a seemingly simple question that I’m afraid needs a very complex answer.

      It depends on a number of important factors:

      1. Is the GEDCOM data for those dates correct? You’ve quoted (I assume) display dates, which will be only kiwitrees best representation of the actually recorded date. For example:
        “2 DATE FROM JUL 1918 TO SEP 1918” would be valid;
        “2 DATE FROM JUL TO SEP 1918” would not.
        “from January 1, 2015 to January 1, 2016” definitely isn’t a valid GEDCOM date either, but if entered like that kiwtrees would / should have converted it.
      2. What are the relevant events attached to these dates? As well as looking at dates kiwitrees sorts events into their “natural” order if it can. This ensures the birth always comes before baptism, marriage, death etc, and so on.
      3. In most cases approximations such as BET/AND or FROM/TO are calculated for the mid-point between the two dates. This doesn’t seem immediately accurate in every case, but equally setting the calculation to either end often results in an incorrect display as well. By their very definition, all this type of date is an estimate, so it has been agreed (for 10+ years) that the mid-point is the safest.

      To be more specific I would need the GEDCOM data for the record in question, so I can load it locally and see what might be impacting on the “perceived” logic.

      Nigel

      My personal kiwitrees site is www.our-families.info

      #5573
      macalter
      macalter
      Participant

      534 posts

      One example is Q1320 Karl Leopold MECKLENBURG-SCHWERIN where I used 1 EVEN for some entries to mimic events where the individual doesn’t have their own record (in this case there’s no record for Sophia Hedwig). There are others where similar results happen.

      marriage to Sophia Hedwig 27 May 1709
      divorce from Sophia Hedwig 1710
      Number of children with Sophia Hedwig (event) from 27 May 1709 to 1710

      I would have expected the number of children to fall between the two other events as there’s a date given for Number of children. Where I use the GEDCOM for Number of children there isn’t so its random placement is not liked but understandable.

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      [updated: 22 May 2017]

      #5574
      kiwi
      kiwi
      Keymaster

      1431 posts

      Problems there are:

      • Using EVENTs means kiwitrees doesn’t know what they are. So it cannot sort them into their “natural”order. If, for example, you used the proper tag for ‘number of children” it woulld know what that means. but can’t if you use
        1 EVEN 0 Sophia Hedwig
        2 TYPE Number of Children
        2 DATE FROM 27 MAY 1709 TO 1710

        it has no idea what the tag means.

      • Using just a year (“1710”) whether on it’s own or as part of a FROM TO set means, to KT, “sometime between 1 JAN 1710 and 31 DEC 1710”. This means your “Number of children” event overlaps with the equally vague 1710 divorce date. In overlapping cases it is the first that has a defined ‘natural’ order that will be displayed first. The way you have it currently at least one of those children could have been born later in 1710 than the date of the divorce.
      • You have a lot of EVENT tags for both Sophia and Christine. With that many surely it would have been quicker to add them as individuals then use the correct (and therefore a little more interpretable) tags? “Right first time” is always quicker in the long run than “right for now” 🙂
      • In general it helps to have dates as specific as possible if you want to manage their chronological placement, especially with non-standard tags. Try making that divorce “BEF 01 JAN 1711”; and the number of children “BET 27 MAY 1709 AND 30 DEC 1710”

      Nigel

      My personal kiwitrees site is www.our-families.info

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